Jack Nicholson & Benicio Del Toro: two reasons to go to the movies talk about their crazy business

Jack. Benicia. No last names needed, thank you. Not with two of the movies' biggest, brightest stars, four Oscars between them: A candid, casual conversation between two colleagues, collaborators and friends in Jack's Beverly Hills living room.

JACK NICHOLSON: All right, Benny. "Mention the title," is what my first ever PR person told me to do. "Mention the title." What films do you have coming out?

BENICIO DEL TORO: I've got The Hunted, with Tommy Lee Jones. It's directed by Billy Friedkin. It's coming out next year. What about you?

JN: This movie they're going to release in December, it's About Schmidt, by Alexander Payne. So what's working with Billy like? You know, I like Billy when he doesn't have a lot of money. He's very inventive.

BDT: This is a Paramount picture, so it's a studio film. Butit had an added edge. He's a fun guy--

JN: --He's a Celtics fan. [both laugh) But I don't hold that against him. What's the film about?

BDT: My character's a soldier who's come back from Serbia and Croatia--all the massacres in that part of the world--and he's kind of disturbed by it. It's made him see things. What's it called? War--

JN: --Post-traumatic stress syndrome?

BDT: Yeah. So he takes to the mountains and turns to the Bible for some kind of salvation. And he's chased by Tommy Lee Jones. Have you done a picture like that, with a chase?

JN: No. [pause] Well, I always have to stop and think. I got chased around in Wolf [1994] and The Passenger [1975].

BDT: What's your new movie about?

JN: My guy, Schmidt, is an actuary. That means he knows when everybody's going to die. He's got statistics on everything. I asked the guys down at the insurance company what the jokes of their profession were, and the one I liked best was you ask an actuary what time it is, and he tells you how to build a clock. [laughs) So Schmidt's all facts at his job, but it's completely self-deceptive. When we started, Alexander said, "Now Jack,"--one of the best directions I've ever got--" I want you to play a small man."

BDT: What makes a small man? I was watching Prizzi's Honor [1985] last night, and you were this small, but big man.

JN: Dedicated, talented.

BDT: Yeah. Dedicated to love. I was laughing out loud watching that movie.

JN: I didn't know it was a comedy when I first read it. [John] Huston [the film's director] was the object lesson in simplicity and economy. You and I, we've only worked together on Sean's [Penn] movie [The Pledge, 2001). I'll tell you, as I've told you before, I was obsessed with your performance in that film. What's interesting to me is--you don't mind my saying this--I don't understand how people ultimately say, "What's a good performance?" because if you asked me to pick a performance in the last few movies I've done which really impressed me, I would say you in that part. I'm crazy about that performance. That's who the guy was. That's who he is. I mean, I can never believe it when people think there's too much character.

What do they exactly mean when they say this?

BDT: Well, I think sometimes it works when there's too much character and sometimes it might not. But I think your performance in Sean's movie was outstanding. I'd come out of Traffic [2000] and everybody's going "Oh, the simplicity!"--

JN: --It's what people feel comfortable liking, and I think all actors simplify as they go on. You get to where you get less mannered, but at the same time, reality could be a trap as an actor, too. In other words, I wouldn't like to be an actor if I could only be real. I like to get wild, behaviorally wild, and it's crazy to think of any form where it's just one way. You know, there are a lot of different forms of movies, but the criteria always seem to be bound. But in the end, we say to ourselves, "If it works, that's it." If I suddenly start talking in a Japanese accent in the middle of a scene, if it works, that's fine. If it doesn't, it's no good. But no matter how unbelievable the circumstances, you always come at it the same way. You know, when we talk about movies today we behave as though there hadn't been [Luigi] Pirandello, [Jean] Genet, [Eugene] Ionesco, [Samuel] Beckett and all these people.

INTERVIEW: Would you call those artists influences?

JN: I've never been able to say I've been influenced by a list of artists I like because I like thousands and thousands and I've been influenced in some way by all of them. Frankly, I got into the movies because I like the movies a lot. When I started off, there were 25 people walking around L.A. in red jackets who looked exactly like James Dean, because he was very extreme and quite easy to imitate, which missed the point entirely. And there was Marion [Brando]. of course, but I said to myself, "Marlon is my idol and I definitely can't do that." So, in many ways, he influenced me on a different level.

I: What about you, Benicio? Who or what were your influences?